Jump to content
Poetry Magnum Opus
  • Announcements

    • tonyv

      Registration -- to join PMO ***UPDATED INSTRUCTIONS***   03/14/2017

      Automatic registration has been disabled. If you would like to join the Poetry Magnum Opus online community, use the "Contact Us" link at the bottom of this page and follow these instructions: 1. Check your email (including your spam folder) in a timely fashion for a reply. 2. After you receive a reply, use the "Sign Up" link at the top right corner of the page to create your account. Do this fast. I've lost my patience with people who use the "Contact Us" link to express interest in joining and then don't bother to check their email for a reply and don't bother to join after registration has been enabled. The queue fills up fast with spammers, and I have to spend my time sifting through the rubbish to delete them. The window of opportunity for joining will be short. I will not have my time wasted. If you don't check your email and you don't bother registering promptly, you will find that registration has been disabled and your future requests to join may go ignored. /s/ Tony ___________________ [Registration will only be enabled for a short while from the time your message is received, so please check your email for a reply and register within 12 hours of using the "Contact Us" link. (Be sure to check your spam folder if you don't see a reply to your message.)]
    • tonyv

      IMPORTANT: re Logging In to PMO ***Attention Members***   03/15/2017

      For security purposes, please use your email address when logging in to the site. This will prevent your account from being locked when malicious users try to log in to your account using your publicly visible display name. If you are unable to log in, use the "Contact Us" link at the bottom of the page.
    • tonyv

      Blogs   05/01/2017

      Blogs are now accessible to Guests. Guests may read and reply to blog entries. We'll see how this works out. If Guest participation becomes troublesome, I'll disable Guest access. Members are encouraged to make use of the PMO Members' Promotional Blog to promote their published works. Simply add your latest entry to the blog. Include relevant information (your name or screen name, poem title, periodical name, hyperlink to the site where published, etc). If you have a lot of them and feel you need your own blog, let me know, and I will try to accommodate you. Members are encouraged to continue also posting their promotional topics in the Promotions forum on the board itself which is better suited for archiving promotions.
abstrect-christ

unnamed poem

Recommended Posts

first time even attempting a sonnet (special circumstances call for it)

 

 

Is this phantasm de facto -- present?

To play draftee was inevitable,

so as burdens pulverize, strike, proceed;

I am left inert and palatable

 

with a trudge like Chaplin’s Tramp: Belied;

my esoteric murmurs audible

till twilight’s crimson dusks deep hue

and keratin portends crucible --

 

what of saving grace?! Magdalen’s curse?

sitting among scorched rose and bone meal

expediting a means for dispersal

ordnance and muzzle, permeate red;

 

silk trails effusive to opaque Cicada’s

for venus’s sails -- vermilion.

 

- Jeremy Swyck

 

how was it? any improvements needed?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Jeremy, I love to see unusual content incorporated into a sonnet. But this is one of those occasions when some more info would be helpful. What are the special circumstances? Why specifically a sonnet? I think knowing more about the background would help me formulate a (hopefully) meaningful reply.

 

Tony

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

guess i should have thought of that eh lol,

k well the character who writes this works in the theatre industry and writes plays and such and has been having visions, nightmares or in reality is doing things to end his loves life or assaulting her in a brutal manner and it gets to the point that he realizes he is a danger to her in his own perception so he thus decided he has no other choice but to end his life bringing about his suicide note which I personally find is most effective being in a sonnet structure to signify his career of choice, which is what's is presented here. The rape scene is from the same series as this is included.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

That does clarify things a bit, Jeremy. I agree that the sonnet is a terrific form of choice for the suicide note you mention.

 

I'll tailor my reply so that it fits within the context of what you said about using the poem as a component of a larger work, a play perhaps. Had you said you wrote this for a contest, or a romantic interest, my reply would probably be different.

 

Most of the time, a sonnet has fourteen lines. It usually has a rhyme scheme, and it's usually written in meter. There's also (usually) a turn of thought somewhere in the second part of the sonnet, (usually) after the first eight lines. There are plenty of exceptions, sonnets of varying length, sonnets with some or no rhyme, sonnets that don't have a turn ("volta"). Let's look at the characteristics of yours.

 

You have the anticipated fourteen lines. You use some rhyme but no meter. The first two quatrains "set the stage," and the poem does seem to have a turn in the third quatrain where the speaker begins to question things. So, I would say, that this poem holds to the spirit of a sonnet. Now, let's look at the language, style, and meaning (suggestions and questions in red).

 

Is this phantasm de facto present? [Omit the dash. By "de facto," do you mean "really" or "actually"?]

To play draftee was inevitable.

So as burdens pulverize, strike, and proceed,

I am left inert and palatable.

 

With a trudge like Chaplin’s tramp belied,

my esoteric murmurs are audible

till twilight’s crimson dusk's deep hue

and keratin portends crucible -- [not sure what this means]

 

What of saving grace?! Of Magdalen’s curse?

Sitting among scorched rose and bone meal

expediting a means for dispersal

ordnance and muzzle permeate red; [Omit the comma after "muzzle." A word other than "permeate" may be in order. Do you mean "produce," "induce," or "elicit"?]

 

silk trails effusive to opaque Cicada’s [This last couplet I can't reach, but it does cause certain inexpressible thoughts to enter my head.]

for venus’s sails -- vermilion.

 

Some people say don't use rhyme without meter, but in my opinion doing so does not always amount to a fatal flaw. I would not take measures to "unrhyme" parts of this that already rhyme or to rhyme more of it unless you want to work on the meter. I could help with that, but I would need a lot of additional clarification from you on meaning.

 

If I misunderstood the parts of the poem I tweaked, it's because I missed the meaning. Let me know if this is helpful or not or if you're looking for different input.

 

Tony

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

De facto is a form of the word fact or factual I guess one can also consider, probably more lingo than actual language but it's in the thesaurus on dictionary.com so I thought it might work. >.> is that too off the wall for a sonnet? I put the emdash there to call attention to how bad the situation is for the character, doesn't quite work out likw I thought it would I take it? And I'll have to work the third line here in the first quatrain I guess, I tried to keep it with in 10 syllables compensating with just the comma but I guess it didn't quite work. <.<

 

Chaplin's most famous character is The Tramp, so that's why that's capitalized, the 'belied' being the narrators opinion on the character thus the colon,

plus wouldn't the added 'are' make it 11 rather than 10 syllables and it's a run off into the next line anyways, does it not work without the are?

The last line in the 2nd stanza/quatrain is saying that with her hair(an infinite origin of beauty) comes the warning signs within visions/nightmares that meld together at the bottom of his skull/consciousness as his personal trip into his inferno deepens. The definition for crucible being a container of metal or refractory material employed for heating substances to high temperatures.

 

Didn't realize I was a syllable off on the first line of the 3rd quatrain, thanks, and the word permeate when I put it down I was thinking a different way of pronunciation rather than perm-i-ate, perm-e-aet/et, but I thought it important to include the description because it links the suicide to the note because in the suicide itself I have description of brain matter "permeating" the wall behind his head. Probably too off the wall for the sonnet though. I'll see what can do with that line, whether I change that or put an asterisk there to note the different pronunciation.

 

The couplet however I tried working my best with as far as imagery, I'm afraid I can't help the allegory, but that's meant to say that her image/nature floats above the darkness he feels the Cidada's imagery there because in most ghost story type anime whenever an evil spirit or presence is around they pipe up almost deafeningly the more evil and so are used as environmental sound keys. And the obv. comparison to a goddess in the last line.

 

does that explain some things?

 

And thanks for some of the corrections, some I wasn't sure of.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
De facto is a form of the word fact or factual I guess one can also consider, probably more lingo than actual language but it's in the thesaurus on dictionary.com so I thought it might work. >.> is that too off the wall for a sonnet?

No, I don't think anything is off the wall for a sonnet, but one have to be careful when it comes to the thesaurus. It will list all the synonyms, but when its user is not familiar with the established usage of a particular word, its use can render absurdities. In other words, you can't just look at the synonyms the thesaurus provides and pick any one. I usually use the thesaurus to find words and double check unfamiliar ones with the dictionary before using them. As for "de facto," I've never seen it used this way (as an adverb). Where I've seen it used a lot is in discussion about law, e.g. when one mentions a de facto law, he is talking about the way a law is applied (or misapplied) in a practical sense i.e. "in the field"; when he talks about a de jure law, he means the intent of the law, or the literal way that it is written (how it should be applied -- as it is written). Of course, it's possible I could just be wrong when it comes to your use of the expression.

 

I put the emdash there to call attention to how bad the situation is for the character, doesn't quite work out likw I thought it would I take it? And I'll have to work the third line here in the first quatrain I guess, I tried to keep it with in 10 syllables compensating with just the comma but I guess it didn't quite work. <.<

No, I added the "and," because I saw it as a grammatical issue, not a metrical issue. I think without it would amount to an appositive, and "proceed" didn't fit with the other two. But I'm no grammar expert. I could be wrong again. We need Waxwings to clarify this. You could use "and," drop the "so," and still keep your syllable count if that's what you're shooting for, but more on that later.

 

Chaplin's most famous character is The Tramp, so that's why that's capitalized, the 'belied' being the narrators opinion on the character thus the colon,

plus wouldn't the added 'are' make it 11 rather than 10 syllables and it's a run off into the next line anyways, does it not work without the are?

In that case, "Tramp" should definitely stay capitalized. But "belied" is another one of those words that might not work. The dictionary says "belie" is a transitive verb (a verb that requires a direct object) and gives the following example: "His smile belied his ire," with "ire" being the direct object that his smile belied. So, my use of it in your line is probably incorrect. It might work if you wrote, "With a trudge that Chaplin's Tramp belied." Then it would serve as a transitive verb, with the trudge being the direct object that Caplin's Tramp "belied," or portrayed falsely. Still, I think it's problematic, and I'm not sure if that adequately expresses your intent.

 

Now, as for the syllables, don't get too caught up in them. It depends on which type of meter you choose for the poem. If you use a syllabic meter (something I have no experience with), I suppose it comes down to just counting syllables without regard to stresses. In accentual-syllabic meter, both ways work (again depending on the desired meter), but, in your way, grammatically you would need a comma after "murmurs":

 

my esoteric murmurs, audible

/ my ES / oTER / ic MUR / murs AUD / ible /

 

my esoteric murmurs are audible

/ my ES / oTER / ic MUR / murs are AUD / ible /

 

Didn't realize I was a syllable off on the first line of the 3rd quatrain, thanks ... Probably too off the wall for the sonnet though.

No, you're syllable use is fine, and it's fine without the "of." I just added it as an example of another way. And, again, I think a sonnet is a terrific choice of form.

 

... he feels the Cidada's imagery there because in most ghost story type anime whenever an evil spirit or presence is around they pipe up almost deafeningly the more evil and so are used as environmental sound keys ...

Didn't know this ... Thanks!

 

Tony

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

First changes:

"Is this phantasm veral? -- Present?

To play draftee was inevitable;

as burdens pulverize, strike and proceed;

I am left inert and palatable"

 

Veral isn't a word but a combo of verity and viral, so is this phantasm 'coursing through me like a virus of natural reality'? Absurdist allegory but my writing tends to lean toward it so it fits in the context of the poem as a whole this way as well. and I like the rhyming nature of the last 2 lines of the first quatrain with the and's added instead, thanks for the advice there.

 

next is the Tramp line since I want to keep the 'I' sound for that last word of the line I'm changing it to:

"with a trudge like Chaplin’s Tramp: Belying,"

 

I guess when I first wrote it I wasn't as into the details as I thought, lol I normally do check my means of use or meaning in such a form as shown. I'll work with the rest of the changes when I get the time next. When I wrote it I decided to stay as close to an english sonnet as possible while going the more 'last word thematic route so...

 

line 1 and 3 ends with an 'en-t' and the variation 'ee-d' sound

line 2 and 4 an "a-ble"

 

then the 2nd quatrain has the symmetrical sound as a variation of the last and further variations on the 'ee' sounds and the placements are switched back and forth as well in each quatrain.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

i think this is outstanding. my mind gets to tired nowadays to focus on being perfect. i try to emulate to much perfection radiate with the raw talent i have. your wrting here the concept is so beautiful and endearing. i absolutely love this. i try working on helping others like tony did but i can't get my own stuff straightened out first. i suffered a serious head injury 15 years ago. that explains why sometimes you see deep meaning in my expressions surrounded by the conscept being water down in several other verses in one of my writings look similiar but one of them is perfection while the rest are cheesy. maybe everyone feels this way bout their own writings. then again i don't permeate to know.

 

 

 

victor

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

thanks Victor.

ok, how's this?

 

 

Is this phantasm veral? -- Present?

To play draftee was inevitable;

as burdens pulverize, strike and proceed;

I am left inert and palatable

 

with a trudge like Chaplin’s Tramp: Belying;

my esoteric murmurs, audible

till twilight’s crimson dusk’s deep hue

and keratin portends crucible --

 

what of saving grace?! Of Magdalen’s curse?

sitting among scorched rose and bone meal

expediting a means for dispersal

ordnance and muzzle, permeate* red;

 

silk trails effusive to opaque Cicada’s

for venus’s sails: vermilion.

 

*intended pronunciation: perm-e-aet

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

you are truly mastering the form of the sonnet in this version of you writes. wow - i am very impressed, maybe more then impressed with this poem. the speculation as you induldge deeper drifting into your mind as we read deeper into this ... there is so much thought put into this and this is so compact and neat. something i have been working on myself.

 

 

much sincerity, and i am no expert...

 

victor

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I like the portmanteau "veral"

 

 

It sounds like the character who pens this poem is unstable. Bearing that in mind, the sonnet presented is hyper modern as compared with the classical form. I don't know too much about it but i think that part of what makes it a sonnet is that it normally has a somewhat regular iambic pentameter meter.

 

I scan it (and i'm very inexperienced with it)

 

/ IS this / PHANtas / m VER / al -- / PREsent? / trochaic pentameter

trochee trochee iamb iamb trochee

 

/ to PLAY/ DRAFtee / WAS in / EVi / taBle/ trochaic pentameter

iamb trochee trochee trochee iamb

 

/ as BUR / dens PUL / verIze /STRIKE and / proCEED/ iambic pentameter

iamb iamb iamb trochee iamb

 

/ i AM / LEFT in / ERT and / PALi / taBle / trochaic pentameter

iamb trochee trochee trochee iamb

 

 

/WITH a / TRUDGE like / CHAPlin’s / TRAMP be / LYing / trochaic pentameter

 

trochee trochee trochee trochee trochee

 

/ my ES / oTER / ic MUR / murs, AUD / iBle / iambic pentameter

 

iamb iamb iamb iamb iamb

 

/ till TWI / light’s CRIM / son DUSK'S / DEEP HUE / iambic tetrameter

 

iamb iamb iamb spondee

 

/ and KER / aTin / porTENDS / CRUci /Ble -- / iambic pentameter

 

iamb iamb iamb trochee spondee

 

 

/ WHAT of / SAving / GRACE of / MAGda / len's CURSE / trochaic pentameter

 

trochee trochee trochee trochee iamb

 

SITting / aMONG / SCORCHed / ROSE and / BONE MEAL trochaic pentameter

 

trochee iamb trochee trochee spondee

 

/ EXpi / DITing / a MEANS / for di / SPERsal / trochaic pentameter

 

trochee trochee iamb pyrrhic trochee

 

/ ORDnance / and MUZ / zle, PER /meate / RED; trouble scanning this meter

 

trochee iamb iamb pyrrhic caesura

 

 

SILK TRAILS / efFUS / ive to / Opaque / ciCAD / da's trouble scanning this meter

 

spondee iamb pyrrhic trochee iamb fem.

 

/ for VEN / uSes / SAILS: ver / MILion / some tetrameter

 

iamb iamb trochee trochee

 

 

 

 

So it looks like mostly trochaic pentameter. However, i am a complete novice and really have no idea whether or not this is helpful or accurate. You could know all this already and it may have been your intent.

 

The suggestion to pronounce permeate in any way other than the way the reader will already have done, seems to be distracting and unnecessary.

 

As to the content it sounds like a dark schism of mind and reality is torturing him and he expresses it in a somewhat melodramatic fashion (although it is a suicide note i guess...so it's bound to be overly dramatic...) Anyway, hope the comments are helpful. It sure helped me in trying to practice some scansion.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi Jeremy, I am coming late to this piece but I enjoyed reading the commentary on this. You have probably long moved on from this sonnet but since this is the Workshop I would belatedly like to add my thoughts.

 

I thought the tone dark and the intellectual word play intriguing and I felt the content was complimented by the chosen form. Technically the sonnet form you used is closest to the English or Shakepearean Sonnet, deviating as you already are aware in the meter but also in the position of the pivot. Your pivot arrives after the 2nd quatrain instead of deeper into the sonnet closer to the declamatory end couplet..

 

As far as meter, Tony has already scanned the piece and I agree it is more a trochaic piece than iambic and that is just fine but, the sonnet should sing, in this case a dirge. Rhythm is key to the lyrical sound of the piece. Reading this aloud, to me some of the lines sound unfinished especially your last line which seems a little anticlimatic.. If it were mine, which it is not, I would play with some of the shorter lines and the lines Tony said he had trouble scanning and try for 5 feet per line. Listen to the rhythm. The pattern being primarily trochaic rather than the standard iambic pattern adds to the dirge quality of the content which is a good choice.

 

Rhyme, I like your near rhyme, and occasional off rhyme. Well done. A technical note about rhyme in English, the stressed syllable of the word is the rhyme therefore with inevitable, crusible audible palatable grammatically none of these words rhyme..This is a common misunderstanding and no one notices this kind of stuff but people like me. ~~smile~~

 

I do like your sonnet, it certainly fits the mold but then breaks it which is what fresh new poetry should do.

 

~~Tink

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

thanks for looking tink and abstract;

to abstract -- given the nature of the condition the persons in who writes it I guess unstable is a good effect and thanks for going into detail with the iambic and trochaic lines; I'll use that for if I need to write another one. I guess my free form background sort of comes out no matter what in the end.

 

to tink -- I did sort of model my sonnet after an english one, so where the couplet is is where my models couplet was... I think, been a bit since I wrote this now >.> And if some of the lines seem unfinished it's probably because I tried keeping some mystery in it that the rest of the poem answers in its own form, the last line in particular I chose to counter balance the abrupt ending and make it look more like it ends there with the colon stating what colour Venus's sails are among the darkness that surrounds her.

 

Again thank you both for looking and I'll take note of all the advice for the next time. :biggrin:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Please sign in to comment

You will be able to leave a comment after signing in



Sign In Now

×

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Guidelines.